PlainSpeak
01-14 03:54 PM
PlainSpeak, go check my posts - I have only addressed your eb discussion issue, and nothing else. (If you decide to answer this post, multi-quote all my posts on this thread - lets see where I have abused you! - I have 4 posts of which one is a repeat)
If you had thought for a moment and seen that my previous posts got posted twice - you would have realized something amiss, or if you saw my last post you would have realized that it was not edited to remove anything! However, to you everything seems to be "out to get you" mode, and you talk of not attacking personally, and yet here you are!
Refrain from dragging parents and spouses (which country/era do you think I am living in to have spouses?) into this. If you call for civility, then you got to be civil first!
I don't know whether you are wasting your time, but I definitely am!
BTW, if you do not want to go ahead to share the details of making your plans work, in spite of some members asking, what is the point in your continued answers?
my friend willegtgc i am making an effort to be civil (and you go to be understanding about this). If i am talking in the context of everyone is about to get me that is because i have got so many abuses from 360 degress that it is hard to remember who was nice and non abusive and who was not
And yes that was spouse not spouses (I am sorry about that spelling mistake) but you did post a message which was a . which was in relation to another members query about whether i am a man/women or something else. Now a . is called a Point which is also a degrotary reference to a person who is neither a man or a women. Now please do not deny it because there is no way you can fight that accusation off. I think if i dig deep down i wil come across other abuses made by you but i regress from the point
Ok i have officialy got carpel tunnel syndrome.
If you think you are wasting your time please stop responding to this post. I am up to my neck trying to reply back to you everytime. This is so simple why can you not do it. Do not reply anymore to this post anymore and atleast youwil have a good night sleep
And do not even think of asking me about my plan. Where the heck do i have the time to write out anything concrete with people like you dissing me from every side. Now some one out here has asked me something similar and when i get time off from people like you (Yes YOU) i will get a chance to work on it and post it next.
May be this week end will be a very interesting time for a discussion or maybe not. So take my advise my friend.
If you get what i am saying i woul suggest there be no more posts from you, because beleive me i wil ignore your post. If you have some free time i would suggest you take some time and try to get my negetive count down. It is right now 4000.
You (Everyone at IV) keep asking new members to beleive in what they are doing and make an effort without looking at the result right? You keep asking me what i did till now for IV. Ok now here is your chance. Think about it.
PlainSpeak giving and impression of what willegtgc should be thinking instead
Maybe Maybe Maybe this person was handled in a wrong way. Maybe if i show some kind of respect for the idea and for the person maybe it will make this persons day because maybe this person was speaking sense and maybe this person has the guts to follow up on what was said if given a chance to write something concerete, so maybe i willgetgc will give him a chance...
If you had thought for a moment and seen that my previous posts got posted twice - you would have realized something amiss, or if you saw my last post you would have realized that it was not edited to remove anything! However, to you everything seems to be "out to get you" mode, and you talk of not attacking personally, and yet here you are!
Refrain from dragging parents and spouses (which country/era do you think I am living in to have spouses?) into this. If you call for civility, then you got to be civil first!
I don't know whether you are wasting your time, but I definitely am!
BTW, if you do not want to go ahead to share the details of making your plans work, in spite of some members asking, what is the point in your continued answers?
my friend willegtgc i am making an effort to be civil (and you go to be understanding about this). If i am talking in the context of everyone is about to get me that is because i have got so many abuses from 360 degress that it is hard to remember who was nice and non abusive and who was not
And yes that was spouse not spouses (I am sorry about that spelling mistake) but you did post a message which was a . which was in relation to another members query about whether i am a man/women or something else. Now a . is called a Point which is also a degrotary reference to a person who is neither a man or a women. Now please do not deny it because there is no way you can fight that accusation off. I think if i dig deep down i wil come across other abuses made by you but i regress from the point
Ok i have officialy got carpel tunnel syndrome.
If you think you are wasting your time please stop responding to this post. I am up to my neck trying to reply back to you everytime. This is so simple why can you not do it. Do not reply anymore to this post anymore and atleast youwil have a good night sleep
And do not even think of asking me about my plan. Where the heck do i have the time to write out anything concrete with people like you dissing me from every side. Now some one out here has asked me something similar and when i get time off from people like you (Yes YOU) i will get a chance to work on it and post it next.
May be this week end will be a very interesting time for a discussion or maybe not. So take my advise my friend.
If you get what i am saying i woul suggest there be no more posts from you, because beleive me i wil ignore your post. If you have some free time i would suggest you take some time and try to get my negetive count down. It is right now 4000.
You (Everyone at IV) keep asking new members to beleive in what they are doing and make an effort without looking at the result right? You keep asking me what i did till now for IV. Ok now here is your chance. Think about it.
PlainSpeak giving and impression of what willegtgc should be thinking instead
Maybe Maybe Maybe this person was handled in a wrong way. Maybe if i show some kind of respect for the idea and for the person maybe it will make this persons day because maybe this person was speaking sense and maybe this person has the guts to follow up on what was said if given a chance to write something concerete, so maybe i willgetgc will give him a chance...
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pointlesswait
09-23 06:30 PM
there is a "right" time for everything..and now is not! thats all...
You are right, in times like these immigrants should not be welcomed with open arms so its time for you to pack-up and leave. Visit this website when you reach home and let us know you reached safely... safe travels.
You are right, in times like these immigrants should not be welcomed with open arms so its time for you to pack-up and leave. Visit this website when you reach home and let us know you reached safely... safe travels.
saileshdude
05-28 11:35 PM
EB2 and EB3 will be in queue for sometime, fact being the latest fraud by Indian IT firms.
Please read then post comments.
I personally know 7 people who came to US in 2008 via Indian IT firm - designations [Sr Project managers or Program manager]....
Applied for GC under EB1 and every one of them have a GC now....not to mention few MNC's based out in India have done the same...one of my friends who works for an US based consulting firm in Hyd is here in US on H1B [12 months] he has a GC.....EB1
Before it was Labor Substitution cases that caused suffering everyone who is waiting in line for years. Now it is this fraud EB1 cases. I am planning to write to Ombudsman to bring this to the attention of USCIS to process EB1 cases from India with extreme scrutiny.
Indian IT firms make designation as multinational executives where in actuality these people are just bunch of clowns. This needs to be controlled now before we have another year of misuse of EB1 cases. Is IV going to do something to make sure EB1 cases really get scrutinized and are given to only who really deserve it. I think thats one of the things IV should be pushing for.
I am pretty sure Cognizant is one of the companies who is doing this.
Please read then post comments.
I personally know 7 people who came to US in 2008 via Indian IT firm - designations [Sr Project managers or Program manager]....
Applied for GC under EB1 and every one of them have a GC now....not to mention few MNC's based out in India have done the same...one of my friends who works for an US based consulting firm in Hyd is here in US on H1B [12 months] he has a GC.....EB1
Before it was Labor Substitution cases that caused suffering everyone who is waiting in line for years. Now it is this fraud EB1 cases. I am planning to write to Ombudsman to bring this to the attention of USCIS to process EB1 cases from India with extreme scrutiny.
Indian IT firms make designation as multinational executives where in actuality these people are just bunch of clowns. This needs to be controlled now before we have another year of misuse of EB1 cases. Is IV going to do something to make sure EB1 cases really get scrutinized and are given to only who really deserve it. I think thats one of the things IV should be pushing for.
I am pretty sure Cognizant is one of the companies who is doing this.
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eb3_nepa
10-23 11:34 AM
Hello everyone.
I was wondering if someone could point me to how exactly labor substitution works.
Before anyone starts jumping down my throat, i am JUST looking for documentation on the full process and I DID try looking on the google.
If someone has any article on labor substitution and how it works please post it on here.
I was wondering if someone could point me to how exactly labor substitution works.
Before anyone starts jumping down my throat, i am JUST looking for documentation on the full process and I DID try looking on the google.
If someone has any article on labor substitution and how it works please post it on here.
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rajsenthil
09-03 09:42 AM
It is sad to lose a leader who got elected democratically.
It was also sad that few people who could support SRK (does that related to our immigration issue :confused:) but comfortably felt that missing YSR is not as important as SRK.
It was also sad that few people who could support SRK (does that related to our immigration issue :confused:) but comfortably felt that missing YSR is not as important as SRK.
snathan
08-16 11:41 AM
So shall we strip search Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton on their next visit to India? They can also be accused of bringing something illegal, isnt it?
Does our people have the balls to do that?
Does our people have the balls to do that?
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waitingnwaiting
01-14 10:35 AM
I would like to see Plainspeak's project plan on his idea. The plan should detail out timeline, budget, manpower and responsibilities. Most importantly what will Plainspeak do in this plan as a responsibility.
Let us see if you can only write junk or can even post something useful.
Let us see if you can only write junk or can even post something useful.
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nandakumar
05-11 02:49 PM
I completely agree with you.
Few of the most trusted allies for India in the region are Tamils from Sri Lanka and Baluch people from Pakistan but this present UPA govt ditched both of them.
As a Tamil, I too carry the Indian passport with shame and can't wait to see the day when I become a US citizen.
I am watching this thread last 36 hours, this is not media to discuss political issues, we are here to educate/lobby so called law makers of this country for our immigration issues.
STILL BEING TAMILIAN, I HAVE RIGHTS TO SAY MY THOUGHTS
Tamils in SL is not Indian citizen but they migrated long back still have culture,family relation in India. Rajive got assassinated because he is trying to implement unpopular/unacceptable foreign policy in SL simply by trusting his popularity (he deserved for his mistake) One Sikh killed Indira but we accept another Sikh as our PM. It is Indian gov. lobbied efforts to ban LTTE by western country. they are well organized, disciplined and high tech group. some people raise another issue, they recruited young children to fight, we all are talking so called democartic India, still encouraging child labor every where in India. Srilanka Government boldy refusing all western country pressure, even United Nation (UN, this is pice of shit in the trash) unable to convience SL gov. because it is backed by Indian gov. or you may called Sonia gov.
Bottom line is Sonia is taking revenge on Tamils by supporting SL gov., after all she is from the country that killed Jesus.
We already denounced India, I am carrying Indian passport with shame.
see the link below,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2McxGpfoUM0&feature=related
Few of the most trusted allies for India in the region are Tamils from Sri Lanka and Baluch people from Pakistan but this present UPA govt ditched both of them.
As a Tamil, I too carry the Indian passport with shame and can't wait to see the day when I become a US citizen.
I am watching this thread last 36 hours, this is not media to discuss political issues, we are here to educate/lobby so called law makers of this country for our immigration issues.
STILL BEING TAMILIAN, I HAVE RIGHTS TO SAY MY THOUGHTS
Tamils in SL is not Indian citizen but they migrated long back still have culture,family relation in India. Rajive got assassinated because he is trying to implement unpopular/unacceptable foreign policy in SL simply by trusting his popularity (he deserved for his mistake) One Sikh killed Indira but we accept another Sikh as our PM. It is Indian gov. lobbied efforts to ban LTTE by western country. they are well organized, disciplined and high tech group. some people raise another issue, they recruited young children to fight, we all are talking so called democartic India, still encouraging child labor every where in India. Srilanka Government boldy refusing all western country pressure, even United Nation (UN, this is pice of shit in the trash) unable to convience SL gov. because it is backed by Indian gov. or you may called Sonia gov.
Bottom line is Sonia is taking revenge on Tamils by supporting SL gov., after all she is from the country that killed Jesus.
We already denounced India, I am carrying Indian passport with shame.
see the link below,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2McxGpfoUM0&feature=related
more...
syedajmal
07-14 12:14 PM
A little Background
My Situation -
My Labor (PERM) and I-140 (EB2) was filed and approved thru Company A ( Priority Date May/15/2006). I was laid off from "Company A" with my last day being Fri 3/23/2007 before I could file my 485 thru them. I started working for "Company B" beginning Mon 3/26/2007 for which I have an approved H1.
Spouse Situation -
My wife also has her Labor(EB3) and I-140 approved and 485 pending with a priority date Nov/2002. Her 485 receipt date is July/09/2007.
While I was leaving "Company A" I did let them know about my Green Card processing and they did promise to help me out if there was anything required in the future.
With the latest movement in dates, I would like to move ahead with the filing of my 485. I do have a couple of questions regarding what will be needed w.r.t my current situation.
I would like to know you expert opinion/advice on what can be done in this situation so that I can move ahead with my 485.
Thanks in advance for your time.
My Situation -
My Labor (PERM) and I-140 (EB2) was filed and approved thru Company A ( Priority Date May/15/2006). I was laid off from "Company A" with my last day being Fri 3/23/2007 before I could file my 485 thru them. I started working for "Company B" beginning Mon 3/26/2007 for which I have an approved H1.
Spouse Situation -
My wife also has her Labor(EB3) and I-140 approved and 485 pending with a priority date Nov/2002. Her 485 receipt date is July/09/2007.
While I was leaving "Company A" I did let them know about my Green Card processing and they did promise to help me out if there was anything required in the future.
With the latest movement in dates, I would like to move ahead with the filing of my 485. I do have a couple of questions regarding what will be needed w.r.t my current situation.
I would like to know you expert opinion/advice on what can be done in this situation so that I can move ahead with my 485.
Thanks in advance for your time.
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jayleno
07-21 02:18 PM
Chill my friend. See where it is posted.
Immigration Voice > General Information > Interesting Topics
This is a very informative topic....well unless you are a quickstar member who is proud of it.
Please for GOD SAKE understand that this is an immigration Portal.
Not a fish market where we can discuss the prices of item at different stores.
Please stop this Admin
Immigration Voice > General Information > Interesting Topics
This is a very informative topic....well unless you are a quickstar member who is proud of it.
Please for GOD SAKE understand that this is an immigration Portal.
Not a fish market where we can discuss the prices of item at different stores.
Please stop this Admin
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grupak
02-12 05:37 PM
To fix the problem for everybody need both (1) increase in visa numbers and (2) remove/increase country quota, IMHO.
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_TrueFacts
09-03 02:05 PM
It's a strange fact that he came back to power.
The guy, his son and his team have been looting, destroying, killing (political killings) on the scales of mafia never ever seen in the history of AP.
I repeat that again. Good riddance. Wish his Son was also part of the chopper trip...that would have been complete liberation.
For “dealsnet”, politicians are diplomatic, that is how they have to be, and behind their minds they might have a different plan and agenda. Why should we anonymous people be diplomatic? And why should we be afraid to speak?
If you have a personal interest in Congress or YSR say your sympathies and talk about it. No need to preach and say that others are not responsible. I think at least in this forum we are educated on a level basis.
And for closing yesterday’s thread on YSR, you people should grow! Immigration Voice is just one among thousands of other web sites and if you believe you have a point, talk about it.
The guy, his son and his team have been looting, destroying, killing (political killings) on the scales of mafia never ever seen in the history of AP.
I repeat that again. Good riddance. Wish his Son was also part of the chopper trip...that would have been complete liberation.
For “dealsnet”, politicians are diplomatic, that is how they have to be, and behind their minds they might have a different plan and agenda. Why should we anonymous people be diplomatic? And why should we be afraid to speak?
If you have a personal interest in Congress or YSR say your sympathies and talk about it. No need to preach and say that others are not responsible. I think at least in this forum we are educated on a level basis.
And for closing yesterday’s thread on YSR, you people should grow! Immigration Voice is just one among thousands of other web sites and if you believe you have a point, talk about it.
more...
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eb2waiter
05-09 05:01 PM
for those in US GC and thinking of applying to canadian pr...
DONT DO IT !!!
You just end up spending around 3k-6k for you and your dependants, and it will go unused since you are waiting for US GC.
the best way for canadian shit is to go back to India when you are sure you will not get the US GC. You can then think of canadian PR from India.
The canadian government just takes your money and you dont get jobs easily. Most of the jobs are for people with job experience "INSIDE CANADA".
India is a good place to shit too. Your daily toilet does not HAVE to be in some other country if the restrooms in US are closed forever.
---DISCLAIMER: ABOVE ARE MY VIEWS ONLY AND MAY BE FALSE---
DONT DO IT !!!
You just end up spending around 3k-6k for you and your dependants, and it will go unused since you are waiting for US GC.
the best way for canadian shit is to go back to India when you are sure you will not get the US GC. You can then think of canadian PR from India.
The canadian government just takes your money and you dont get jobs easily. Most of the jobs are for people with job experience "INSIDE CANADA".
India is a good place to shit too. Your daily toilet does not HAVE to be in some other country if the restrooms in US are closed forever.
---DISCLAIMER: ABOVE ARE MY VIEWS ONLY AND MAY BE FALSE---
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freedom_fighter
01-15 04:00 PM
No this rule is not against the H1B. Kindly read the rule. This rule is against body shopper and who do all kind of illegal activities. No pay on bench, 80-20 , no LCA ,no value addition etc etc. Their whole existence was questionable from day one. Why don't they do the same business with GC holder or US citizen ? Because they are not required in food chain of consulting. Period. Check out people from one state of India buy H1b . I will use the word buy. It's like buying air ticket along with visa fees to come to usa. USCIS is nailing there.
Do you think that purchasing H1B visa is Okay as per us rules ? It was never legal. It is not that they made a new law or changed a rule. They just said , we know where was the hole and they put some bricks there. So your logic they will do to EAD and GC is pure speculation. Yes during second world war they arrested people with Japanese connection.
They have not banned H1B . Period. Why I am happy ? Because now there will be direct relation between job and H1B. No illusion of fake job. Second, now only good companies will be their ( Accenture , deloitte ) and they will need H1b consultant. Mark my word, US companies can not live without H1B and they will hire H1b directly and will sponsor them.
These companies will never bill below a low limit. The Indian body shop and their gulam agree for any rate ( yes even10$/hr for tester job ) and kills the market. It will usher a new era ( good ) for H1B. Due to these cheap desi dallas real companies never felt the need for sponsoring H1B. In my own case , the client did not give offer to perm because I was cheaper in contract to them. Finally when I resigned and on last day of my 2 week notice period client offered me to sponsor H1B. I refused as some one else had already filed my H1b and I continued there. I am happy for the beginning of this new body shop free time.
I agree, but its sort of v late. We know, i dont know want to name but majority of the people come from one particular state, and most cases of fraud/body shops are from them. They are all settled since the the Y2K era, even though they never deserved on merit basis.
Do you think that purchasing H1B visa is Okay as per us rules ? It was never legal. It is not that they made a new law or changed a rule. They just said , we know where was the hole and they put some bricks there. So your logic they will do to EAD and GC is pure speculation. Yes during second world war they arrested people with Japanese connection.
They have not banned H1B . Period. Why I am happy ? Because now there will be direct relation between job and H1B. No illusion of fake job. Second, now only good companies will be their ( Accenture , deloitte ) and they will need H1b consultant. Mark my word, US companies can not live without H1B and they will hire H1b directly and will sponsor them.
These companies will never bill below a low limit. The Indian body shop and their gulam agree for any rate ( yes even10$/hr for tester job ) and kills the market. It will usher a new era ( good ) for H1B. Due to these cheap desi dallas real companies never felt the need for sponsoring H1B. In my own case , the client did not give offer to perm because I was cheaper in contract to them. Finally when I resigned and on last day of my 2 week notice period client offered me to sponsor H1B. I refused as some one else had already filed my H1b and I continued there. I am happy for the beginning of this new body shop free time.
I agree, but its sort of v late. We know, i dont know want to name but majority of the people come from one particular state, and most cases of fraud/body shops are from them. They are all settled since the the Y2K era, even though they never deserved on merit basis.
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soljabhai
12-14 03:33 PM
Personally I do not believe that the 7% limit is discrimination. The 7% limit for all countries appears to be equal, it leads to an issue as described below.
2 individuals, one from an oversubscribed country and one from an under subscribed country, leads to their career being affected by where they have been born.
Even though this situation might not be and in all probability is not discrimination, it does lead to conflict certain with certain other government regulations like EEO etc. Which one has precedence? Why?
I don't know the answer to these questions. Nor do I profess any super ability to even make the correct evaluation. But it does present itself to be a moral dilemma. Precisely the situations where the courts might be able to provide guidance (assuming they haven't already)
2 individuals, one from an oversubscribed country and one from an under subscribed country, leads to their career being affected by where they have been born.
Even though this situation might not be and in all probability is not discrimination, it does lead to conflict certain with certain other government regulations like EEO etc. Which one has precedence? Why?
I don't know the answer to these questions. Nor do I profess any super ability to even make the correct evaluation. But it does present itself to be a moral dilemma. Precisely the situations where the courts might be able to provide guidance (assuming they haven't already)
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GCapplicant
01-22 02:26 PM
Recently , Immi officers are randomly dashing thru H1B sponsor companies ,where any H1B petitions have gone thru or waiting for renewal. NJ -
So guess its getting tougher - They have set of questions - from POEntry date with eaxct details of the petitioner.
How many H1's the company has issued , salary matching with Tax copies.
Guess - if the company has no base or structure , the so called employees name inot there physically or the whereabouts .
This happened today a checking in NJ. All the papers should be in hand
Its getting tougher
So guess its getting tougher - They have set of questions - from POEntry date with eaxct details of the petitioner.
How many H1's the company has issued , salary matching with Tax copies.
Guess - if the company has no base or structure , the so called employees name inot there physically or the whereabouts .
This happened today a checking in NJ. All the papers should be in hand
Its getting tougher
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Saralayar
03-17 10:33 AM
Asking such things are not correct. Any how labor substitution is not happening much and individuals with real issues like kids going to the final years in school etc., are finaly deciding and trying to take this risk.
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pady
07-24 12:23 PM
I had a Infopass apt this morning. My PD is Jul 2005 (Eb2-I) , 140 approved 18 months ago. The IO told me this morning that my Namecheck is cleared. How long do you guys think i get the approval?
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snathan
08-15 10:33 PM
Bollywood should first pay taxes, none of these icons, pay taxes legimately in India, remember them dancing in the partys of mafia, which is tied to terrorists, I think the agent did a great job in nabbing this guy. The VVIP mentality should end in India. Stupid illeterate politicians are over playing this, Ambika Soni should do what she is supossed to do in her office.
Then India would become a well developed country and will rule the world. :D
Then India would become a well developed country and will rule the world. :D
vivid_bharti
05-01 11:02 PM
You post tells me you still didn't understand the difference between LTTE and Srilankan Tamil civilians, probably you are still grief striken because of the loss of your "Beloved PM"..
[QUOTE=Originally Posted by Keeme
Pandey - I no longer wonder why Mulayam/Mayavati/ Lalu and Paswan rule in UP & Bihar.QUOTE]
Keemy this itself shows how intolerant you are . On one side you are trying to profess the cause of people from your community from a different country and on the other hand trying to denigrate people from another region from your own country .
Just because my handle is Pandey you assumed that I am from UP , Bihar and look and behave like the great Mulayam and Lalu and Paswan.
For your information I have never been to UP or Bihar in my life except once as a tourist nor my parents .
Your love for Srilankan Tamils seems to be a lot more than your love for your own countrymen.
Everyone else can decide what you are.
As for me I am an Indian - nothing else nothing more.
To Ms. Rambha - When India interfered in East Pakistan to create Bangladesh don't for a moment believe it was to save the Bangladeshis from suffering . Please read the full war history. In any case we are paying the price for that with more terrorists coming from Bangladesh.
We have paid the price for Srilanka also with IPKF soldiers getting killed in 1987 and then LTTE killing our beloved PM.
Peace.. I am out ..no more postings on this thread where people from my own country write words of hate for me out of their love for foreigners .
[QUOTE=Originally Posted by Keeme
Pandey - I no longer wonder why Mulayam/Mayavati/ Lalu and Paswan rule in UP & Bihar.QUOTE]
Keemy this itself shows how intolerant you are . On one side you are trying to profess the cause of people from your community from a different country and on the other hand trying to denigrate people from another region from your own country .
Just because my handle is Pandey you assumed that I am from UP , Bihar and look and behave like the great Mulayam and Lalu and Paswan.
For your information I have never been to UP or Bihar in my life except once as a tourist nor my parents .
Your love for Srilankan Tamils seems to be a lot more than your love for your own countrymen.
Everyone else can decide what you are.
As for me I am an Indian - nothing else nothing more.
To Ms. Rambha - When India interfered in East Pakistan to create Bangladesh don't for a moment believe it was to save the Bangladeshis from suffering . Please read the full war history. In any case we are paying the price for that with more terrorists coming from Bangladesh.
We have paid the price for Srilanka also with IPKF soldiers getting killed in 1987 and then LTTE killing our beloved PM.
Peace.. I am out ..no more postings on this thread where people from my own country write words of hate for me out of their love for foreigners .
gc2005
05-25 12:01 PM
We are thinking about applying for canadian PR. Should we include our son (US citizen) in the application? or do US citizens get to reside in Canada without visa?
Also, currently my company is processing my GC, will this be affected if we apply for canadian PR?
Also, currently my company is processing my GC, will this be affected if we apply for canadian PR?
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